MattB

Still stalls out with fuel heater disconnected. We also disconnected the glowplug relay command wires, and the connector on the trans for the solenoids. Monitoring datalogger, PRNDL holds park during stall.

I'll give it a shot this morning and let you know. Thanks!

Anybody? Forgot to mention it dies instantly like the key is turned off. No fuel knock or anything. ICP falls out after RPM drops, not before.

I'm stuck hard on this one, hopefully someone can provide guidance. It's a 98 1/2 E450 with a 7.3. Came in as a crank/no start. Pulled codes. P1663, P1667, P1668, P1670 present. Ran the PPT's and went further. I've load tested both PCM powers, 5 PCM grounds, IDM power, IDM ground, the FDCS wire, CI wire, feedback wire, and signal return from PCM to IDM. At this point I replaced the IDM. It started and ran for a minute, then stalled out. Swapped in a known good PCM. It will now run for anywhere from 5 minutes to 1.5 hours, then stumble and catch itself or die. At this point I disconnected all 3 wire sensors on the engine except CMP. Still acts up. Probed VREF at PCM, holds 5 volts during stall event. Was told to watch VSS during event and see if it spikes. It holds 0 mph during stall. Disconnected alternator and still stalls out. PCM diode is oriented correctly, and I have 12v to PCM. After a few stalls, I will usually lose communication with IDS, but the van will still start and run. When it stalls, I don't have glowplug or WIF light illuminated in IC indicating that PCM wasn't reset or losing power. I verified pinfit with the rotunda probe kit on every pin at PCM and IDM. I don't see any harness chafe, and wiggle test reveals nothing. CMP looks new. If you made it through reading all that, I appreciate it. Please let me know what I might be missing. Hotline was stumped. They escalated it to some special team, and I think I have them stumped. FSE isn't an option due to vehicle age. EDIT: It's a school bus conversion

Are they both at the latest level? If the older one has the original file it will have less power.

about 130k. Has 4x4 conversion, its a material services truck traveling into mines. It's an 11 passenger wagon. The van is really rough, but fluids and filters look maintained. Has almost 2000 PSI ICP within 2 seconds of cranking. Sometimes takes 30 sec of cranking to fire. Also has full fuel pressure when key is turned on. No sign of fuel in oil, no sign of oil in fuel. Injectors were all just removed and resealed. It's got a new IPR valve. It had ICP circuit codes also and a wire fault was found and repaired. It's not road worthy, so we can't take it out on the public hwy to drive it. I will talk to the guy tomorrow and get more info to post up. It had a long list of DTC's originally, now it passes koeo/koer/injector/contribution, no dtc's stored. All injectors buzz loudly. We're kinda lost on this one. It appears to have air, fuel, and compression available. Shouldn't be a problem, right? The only other thing I can think of is maybe a very brief VREF short to ground. It has a fuel knock as it starts to run rough, and we can pull full fuel flow out of the rear of the heads as it's running rough and stalling. So mechanically it seems to have everything it needs to run, it would almost have to be something shutting down the injectors. Any idea how the IDS reacts to a VREF short on a 7.3? I guess it'd be easy enough to figure out. Thanks for the reply, let me know if you have any ideas for us to try. Otherwise I think we'll try shorting it out tomorrow to see how it reacts.

We've got a 2001 E350 in the shop that will run rough and stall at cruise or accel. Runs great at idle and seems to do so indefinately. Sounds like fuel knock when it starts to go. It will always restart, but has a long crank. Will consistantly act up in the shop by redlining, stalls within a minute or two. Fuel filter is new motorcraft. Fuel supply is verified. Measured 70 PSI at the pump and 65 at the rear of the heads. Inlet restriction at WOT is a max of 5"hg. Also tried sucking straight out of a fuel can with known good fuel. No fuel aeration was noted when sample was taken at the rear of the heads, even when it was acting up. ICP voltage KOEO is .23V. Passes oil aeration test, IPR never exceeds 65%. Oil looks good, customer states it was replaced recently. ICP reads 1500 PSI when van stalls. What else are we missing? Something else I'll mention. We have alot of needle fluctuation (bounce) when measuring fuel pressure at the heads. Not sure if it's normal or not, can anyone confirm?

I have a 2005 excursion in the shop that is set up for fire dept use. It's drawing down the batteries at idle with all the extra lights on. I want to hook up the battery charge protect circuit to bump the idle up when it sits, but can't find the circuit for it in the manual. For the superduties it's pin 9 on connector 1 at the PCM. I can't find anything similar in the excursion diagrams. Anyone got this going on an excursion before without an aftermarket controller?

How low is the reservoir after the first crank and stall? All of them I have checked as normal have been full to the top. I found this in the PC/ED if it helps: "The level in the oil reservoir should also be checked. Remove the inspection plug in top of reservoir and check to see if the oil reservoir is full (a reservoir that drains back after the engine has not been operated for a period of time can cause a hard start or a start and die condition). Filling the reservoir will allow the system to prime faster, facilitating starting."

Any tattle tales in mode 6? Like misfire count way higher on one cyl? If you find an injector problem, make sure you check for the glitter in fuel.

The only way I could see the BG kit working is as a routine prevantative maintenance, but if you figure out the cost if that it couldn't possibly be worth it. I think me and Tony are talking about the same BG guy too... Chicago might be using the stuff, but it's Chicago politics. The only reason it's being used is because somebody's pockets are getting lined higher up the chain.

Ford keeps making the deal sweeter and sweeter for us, don't they?

SOunds like fuel injector sticking open. Would explain the smoke and the misfire that spreads to the others on the bank. Crack the lines loose at the injectors and catch the fuel in clean tissue paper and check for glitter. We had one similar a few months back, turned out to be a hi psi pump coming apart, and the metal would intermittantly stick injectors causing a misfire that would come and go, and it would also intermittantly stick the VCV and PCV causing a buck and surge between 55-65 mph. The main cause of a failed hi psi pump is water in fuel, BTW.

The pids you pulled for the IC are only for output state control, they don't reflect what the vehicle is actually doing. The one on the top flips the needle from 0mph to max MPH, and the other allows incrimental changes. Look at your rear speed signal towards the last 5 seconds of your recording. It looks like crap. You also have inconsistant readings further up on the rear sensor around -12.5 sec and 7 sec., just not as bad. I bet if you zoom in on that it will match the VSS reading to the PCM. Unless you have wheel slip or chatter going on there, the reading should be smooth as glass like the front wheel speed sensors. Backprobe the sensor and monitor A/C voltage output with the O-Scope function on the IDS. If it's inconsistant when it acts up, you have a sensor or ring issue. If it's clean, backprobe at the ABS module. If it's crappy, you have a circuit issue between the sensor and module. Another quick test is to overlay the circuit from the sensor straight to the module. If it's better, it's a circuit issue. If I remember right, these are real common for sensors, fuzz in the connector at the sensor, wires breaking in the rear connector, and chafe along the frame by the fuel tank. 95% were sensors though.

I went through the same shit about a month back. We had a coked up intake on one and my boss wanted me to give this a try instead of pulling the intake and cleaning it manually. So BG comes out and we run his crap through. I pulled the elbow afterwards and the only difference was that now I had puddles of his solvent in the intake. My BG guy says "I'm not too surprised, that's the worst one I've ever seen"! It was bad, but far from the worst I've seen. What's funnier is that's the same thing he said after he demo'd one to us at my last place. From his talk before we did it, you'd think it would have been spotless regardless of how bad it was. I don't think he expected me to inspect it afterwards. It's all just a show. He expects us to be in awe from the huge clouds of smoke when we run the cleaner, and then we're sure to feel the difference on our drive afterwards. Just like the "tornado" and "fuel atomizer"