DamageINC Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 What's up fellas? Got me a winner here, I'm hoping to get some input back from the crew here 2004 F-250, 6.0. Thing got towed in, was just purchased at an auction. Apparently it drove through the auction and hasn't started ever since. This thing has has had a tuner, propane injection, full exhaust, yadda-yadda.. lots of go-fast goodies and NO signs of any "preventative" mods, so it still has the stock EGR cooler, stock head bolts & gaskets... Crank no start. TONS of smoke while cranking, (No joke, 30 seconds of cranking and it looked like Bob Marley's basement in the shop) the smoke smells like raw fuel. Every now and then I'll get a sputter from a few cylinders that actually fire (followed by a nice smoke-ring out the exhaust) for a second but it simply won't start. Cranking RPM at around 180-200, checked compression in only one cylinder but it was over 400psi. Has SYNC, FICMSYNC, good ICP (voltage and pressure), FICM voltages are all good (11.5-ish for the L and V and 48 for the M) Good fuel, new fuel filters, and a laundry list of codes from the programming. For what it's worth, there's an audible tick from the engine while cranking but I haven't determined the source yet. I'm also pretty sure the head gaskets are wiped out on this thing - everything under the hood is dirty EXCEPT for the coolant bottle, which has a new cap, and is awkwardly nice and freshly cleaned, as well as improperly installed. It looks like someone pulled the bottle and cleaned it up, replaced the cap, and shoved it back under the hood. No coolant in the bottle. Removed the EGR valve - not stuck open, very little carbon, not wet at all. Inside of intake is also dry. Any thoughts?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Cranks and smokes but no start... makes me think FICM, fuel quality/contamination, glow plugs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamageINC Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 Well, I just checked another cylinder for compression and got 400 again. We finally had some aerosol cans show up so I gave the intake a whiff of starting fluid and it fired right up and is currently running right now. I haven't shut it off since. (I can say that after 10 minutes of idling, I pulled the cap off the degas bottle and it sounded like I ripped the valve stem out of a tire, lol) I also thought maybe the glow plugs/GPCM, but there were no codes for that at all and I haven't really had any glow plug problems with 6.0's in the past (not to say that it can't happen, of course) so I am a little less likely to lean in that direction as of now. Question - can head gaskets fail to the point where they create this condition? Say, if there was enough coolant in the cylinders (even under cranking) that it created an environment that wasn't conducive to diesel combustion while cranking? (But once started, cylinder temperatures reach a level that work out.) EDIT: Brake torquing, this thing reaches about 8psi of boost and starts SPRAYING coolant out of the bottle. This is with ECT at only about 140*F right now too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Oh wow, got yourself a winner there! I have had a banks 6 gun chip cause a glowplug nonfunction and no cold start.It was an inline one between engine harness and pcm. What did the glow plugs look like that you pulled? Possibly the propane injection has smoked the glow plugs? Have you run a KOEO GPM test? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Mutter Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Are you 100% sure that they are factory head gaskets? I had one that had hypermax head gaskets in it and they are not mls they are composite. This one was so blown out it would hydro lock if you put coolant into the engine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deezul Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 Results of power balance and relative compression? Does it hydrolock when you leave it sit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamageINC Posted January 22, 2011 Author Share Posted January 22, 2011 Well, it also had wiring issues when it first came in that caused a no-crank too. Once I got it to crank, it did hydrolock for a second but cranked through it, lol. This thing, once hot, would even vent coolant out of the bottle AT IDLE. We told the customer that we'd need to rip the heads off (and probably replace them) just to get started, with the potential for more damage to be found during teardown. Given that this thing has likely overheated before, I checked the oil filter standpipe but it was in good shape. I'm not at a dealer anymore, so unfortunately I have limited access to testing equipment and Power Balance/Relative Compression isn't available to me right now. We do have access to an IDS but we don't have it in our shop at the moment. But they do appear to be the stock MLS gaskets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikill Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 I was going to say check for combustion gases in fuel but you said you have it running now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I have seen egr coolers blown so bad that it caused the same concern. Looked like a train smoking thru the degas bottle with the cap off. Not saying that the head gaskets are blown, but the one i had i replaed the egr cooler and oil cooler and it was good to go. No extreme coolant pressure afterwards. Just my 2 cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joshbuys Posted January 29, 2011 Share Posted January 29, 2011 I have seen egr coolers blown so bad that it caused the same concern. Looked like a train smoking thru the degas bottle with the cap off. Not saying that the head gaskets are blown, but the one i had i replaed the egr cooler and oil cooler and it was good to go. No extreme coolant pressure afterwards. Just my 2 cents. +1....seen this scenario several times! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamageINC Posted January 31, 2011 Author Share Posted January 31, 2011 Yeah, but I mentioned I popped the EGR valve out and didn't see anything even remotely looking like an EGR cooler failure. Intake was bone dry. I did have an oil cooler create a venting concern once but it was under load only... anyone think this is possible at idle too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbriggs Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 A restricted oil cooler will vent because coolant boils in the egr cooler and creates (steam) pressure. I doubt there would be enough egr flow, or exhaust temperature to boil it at idle... Unless the cooler is completely 100% plugged... Stopping egr flow at idle should remove the venting at idle if that were the case. You could remove the cover plate from the egr cooler hose addapter and look down into the oil cooler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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