GregH Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Ok, so I'm trying to put together this 6.4 short block job, and I'm really running into trouble with the head torque procedure... I can't seem to keep the bolts from chattering while torquing. During the first round of 90 degrees, half of the bolts started to chatter. Unfortunately, this tended to blow out the end of the socket I was using. So, after breaking or spreading just about everyone's 16mm and 5/8ths sockets, I stopped and tried it again with another new set of bolts and another gasket. Same result. I've got all of the bolts past the first round of 90 degrees, and a few through the second round... The heads of the bolts are starting to show wear from the chattering. Snap-on will have me a 5/8ths 3/4" drive socket tomorrow... I was considering using anti-seize on the threads and under the bolt head instead of engine oil.. What I don't understand is that this is the second short block I've done... The first one went through this procedure with no problems, and just one or two bolts chattering... Anyone have any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Anything down in the holes, oil or other???? It almost sounds like it's hydralocking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregH Posted June 1, 2009 Author Share Posted June 1, 2009 The holes are nice and clear - threads are clean... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rlchv70 Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 Try this: Run the bolts up and down the threads with an impact 4 or 5 times without them tightening up. This will "break in" the threads and prevent the chattering. You can then torque them to spec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted June 1, 2009 Share Posted June 1, 2009 I had a head off of one of these to repair a seized valve and I noticed the chatter you mention on one or two bolts on the last turn of the torque sequence. If it had happened earlier in the sequence or to more bolts I would have been more concerned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastendpowerstroke Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 The ARP molly lube that comes with a set of head studs works great. I try to save any extra I get ahold of to use when torquing head bolts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 I have a can of this stuff in my toolbox. ARP #100-9906 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregH Posted June 2, 2009 Author Share Posted June 2, 2009 Thanks... Snap-on should have me a 3/4 drive socket this morning, and I'll try putting antiseize on the bolts this time around... I appreciate the suggestions... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrunoWilimek Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Not on the 6.4, but the 6.0, I have tried anti-seize and engine oil under the heads of the bolts and I thought it actually made the chatter worse. I just lubed the threads of the last 6.0 bolts I did heads on and no chatter. I put it down to changing the torque co-efficient so that the initial turning of the bolts to a specified torque actually over-tightened the bolts so that when 90 degreeing them, you were way past what they should have been torqued to. I don't have any evidence to back this theory up, but it seemed to work for me, anyhow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DamageINC Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Personally I've always used engine oil to lubricate the threads (and I always blow out the threads with compressed air before installing the bolts) and I very rarely encounter any chattering.. In fact, I think ever since I started blowing the threads out with air, I don't know that I've ever had chattering bolts anymore. The key is to JUST LUBRICATE the threads, not coat them so the bolt is dripping. If the bolt is dripping oil, then it can pool up at the bottom of the thread hole and cause a hydralock condition until enough fluid seeps past the threads and then you'll get that chattering. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony302600 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 I had a mother of a time torquing the heads down on my first 6.4L head job. I think i used the ARP stuff and an apprentice to torque them down. I'm 100% sure I used a metric socket also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikill Posted June 4, 2009 Share Posted June 4, 2009 I usually dip the bolts in oil and then tap them against the tire to get the excess oil off of the bolt so that it's not dripping with oil while I install them in the holes. Then I run them down with the cordless impact. Then start the torque procedure. I haven't had any problem so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregH Posted June 5, 2009 Author Share Posted June 5, 2009 Well, got back on it today... A little bit of antisieze under the bolt head made all the difference... I've got a new friend with this socket - IM202 from snapon.. I'd sure hate to get hit by someone with this in their fist.... Oh, and when I looked at the underside of the bolt head, one half of the head was dry... Matched with a dry semicircle on the cylinder head. The bolt heads were oily when they went in - did the clamping force squeeze every trace of oil from half of the circle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BustedKnucklez Posted June 5, 2009 Share Posted June 5, 2009 I also just lightly lube the threads with clean oil. I have this can of CAT Moly Paste and I put a light coat of this on the bolt shoulders where it makes contact with the head and they go on smoothly and are easier to torque. You do have to also make sure that the holes are clean. I spray brake clean in there until it comes out of the holes clear and then blow it out with a blow gun. It works for me. I would like to reiterate what DamageINC said about coating them until they drip oil. That can also give you improper torque because of the compression of the oil at the bottom. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted June 6, 2009 Share Posted June 6, 2009 Quote: Oh, and when I looked at the underside of the bolt head, one half of the head was dry... Matched with a dry semicircle on the cylinder head. Now that you mention that, when I was at Cummins and the ISX first came out we had similar problems getting the correct torque due to the flange drying out, mind you the ISX has a torque spec of 600ft.lbs. on the head bolts, we ended up using anti-seize on them to, it fixed the problem with the torque values. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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