ChristopherH Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 The shop I work at is a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury dealer, but we also have the pleasure of a Jeep franchise as well. Our Chrysler rep visited yesterday and told us that the local Dodge dealer is going basket case on their warranty stuff and turning away all of the Cummins warranty repairs. We work on the Liberty and new Grand Cherokee diesel--although very rarely here. Not much experience with the Cummins engine in pickups--put a few transfer pump retro kits and a few 24 valve injection pumps on--but thats about it. Well, the Chrysler rep told us that we could go ahead and start working on the trucks with the cummins warranty concerns. We have the DRB III, StarScan, etc. but no other special tools for working on the Cummins motor in the trucks. Our service manager is working on scheduling training and finding necessary tools. My question is this: what specific Miller tools do we need to work on the 5.9 and 6.7 cummins motors? If anybody could help me out here and give me a short run down of at least the basic diagnostic tools that are needed frequently I would appreciate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Is the Ford dealer willing to work with you? If not I see that your in Utah, Your closest Cummins Distributor is Cummins Rocky Mountain in Salt Lake City 800-851-4317. They should be able to assist you with the tools you will need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bruene Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Keep in mind that Cummins equipped Chryslers use their own electronics and diagnostic equipment. INSITE will not work on a Dodge truck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherH Posted January 16, 2009 Author Share Posted January 16, 2009 Thanks for the replies guys--I know most of us here are not Dodge techs and wouldn't have this info. As far as the diagnostic equipment goes, being that we are a Jeep dealer, we do have the same scan tools that the Dodge dealers use (DRB III, StarScan, and whatever that new PC based scan tool that is coming is called) We can pull dtcs, look at all the data, flash the modules, etc just fine. What I am mainly looking for is tools that we would need for example to hook up a fuel pressure gauge, or to replace injectors, injector tubes, or otherwise perform any common service on these engines. Chrysler does not send us any special tools unless they relate to Jeep, so we are at a disadvantage here. The trainings that we have been to for the Jeep diesels do not really touch on the 5.9 or 6.7 cummins motors either, so we are a little in the dark there. I have been surfing the repair manuals on the Chrysler website for info, but so far I only have a very short list of stuff. Thanks for the info on the cummins distributor in Salt Lake City--I will get in touch with them and see if they could help. The big problem is that you can't just call Miller/SPX (Dodge special tools supplier) and tell them to send you all the Cummins stuff because the tools were released over many years a few at a time and are included in different kits. Also, we were hoping to narrow down the special tools to the ones needed most frequently and the ones where no workaround is possible, just to save the dealer a little money (I know, I know--not my idea). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 If you really are going to get into the repairs of the Cummins, do yourself a favor and subscribe to Cummins Quick-Serve Online, it's ESN driven and has parts,service and all the current most up to date info not to mention has the special tool info that you will need. It is a really good tool for your shop to use. Your manager or D/P may be doubtful about doing it because of the cost for the yearly subscription but trust me you will save yourself alot of time and headache. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Adema Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 If you're going to be getting into doing warranty work on Cummins equipped Dodge trucks, there are lots of basic, and lots of wierd tools to obtain. Daimler/Miller's engine performance testing equipment is necessary, ie fuel pressure gauges and adapters for doing injector return flow tests and CP3 pump tests (all that info is on the Chrysler site). You'll want the engine turning tool and injection pump stuff for the older engines, if you don't already have them. Seal drivers for crankshaft, transmission, and diff seals....Terminal tools for electronic terminals.....compression test adapters....I'll think of more, just give the hamster a chance to get warmed up before he runs on the big wheel.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimani Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 If you really are going to get into the repairs of the Cummins, do yourself a favor and subscribe to Cummins Quick-Serve Online, it's ESN driven and has parts,service and all the current most up to date info not to mention has the special tool info that you will need. It is a really good tool for your shop to use.You are very right.I also has removal and installation instructions.you also get specs.Lovely engine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherH Posted January 19, 2009 Author Share Posted January 19, 2009 Thanks for the suggestions guys, I appreciate them very much. I have been impressed with a lot of the stuff on the Cummins engines (compared to the 6.0s I work on every day). Our dealer is very small (5 techs, 1 lof guy, 1 used car guy) so we end up doing all kinds of repairs, but I do more diesel stuff than anything else. I know how Chrysler warranty time pays, being that we are a Jeep dealer as well, and I am not really excited at that prospect. Any suggestion to help give a guy an edge is greatly appreciated. Things have slowed down dramatically here in the past several months, and I would rather be losing a little time working on a Cummins that I don't quite understand everything about yet than sitting around making 0$. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon Posted January 19, 2009 Share Posted January 19, 2009 I don't know if you have the coffee table book for the 6.7 yet, but if you want it, let me know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherH Posted January 20, 2009 Author Share Posted January 20, 2009 I don't have that yet, and I would love to get my hands on it. Do you have an electronic version of it? Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 You have mail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 I was thinking... Since we may be dealing with Cummins as the only engine option on F-650/750 engines in the near future maybe we need to start collecting this kind of information and add it to the coffee table collection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon Posted January 21, 2009 Share Posted January 21, 2009 You too have mail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dieseldoc Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 That is a very great idea keith!! The info would be very helpful to many of us I think. With the slowing economy and seeming lack of work out there. I know I wont be turning down other products if at all possible. I have worked on a few dodges with cummins engines and they are not as tough as you may think. I havent had to work on any new 6.7s but the older common rails are a lot easier to work on access wise than the 6.0s and 7.3 superduties. just my two cents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 I am sure nothing is beyond our abilities. Not having the necessary tools and documentation however is another matter entirely. Having never touched a Cummins engine except for training many years ago I respectfully decline since I would be working totally blind. Being able to look over a document such as this will at the very least provide some familiarity. I am sure when you break it down it is no different than a CAT or an International and so on and so forth, etcetera, etcetera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Adema Posted January 26, 2009 Share Posted January 26, 2009 Nuts and bolts are nuts and bolts. You need spec's, test procedures, theory of operation/engine management strategies, and ACCURATE WIRING DIAGRAMS! Beyond that, though, they're all the same hooey. Damon, could you pass on to me some reading? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChristopherH Posted January 27, 2009 Author Share Posted January 27, 2009 Thanks again Damon--I had a chance over the weekend to read through that info and there is quite a few differences in the aftertreatment system and some of the sensors. (oxygen sensors on a diesel--oh boy!) At least now I know a little bit more about these things until our Dealer can get us caught up with our technical training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 Drop me a PM on here, I'd be interested in that coffee table book. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damon Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 Drop me a PM on here, I'd be interested in that coffee table book. Thanks! PM sent Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shlep Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 I was thinking... Since we may be dealing with Cummins as the only engine option on F-650/750 engines in the near future maybe we need to start collecting this kind of information and add it to the coffee table collection? I've been thinking the same thing, even contacted the instructors with not much luck so far, but Cummins advised me to contact the head office in order to enroll in a course when they become available. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LARRY BRUDZYNSKI Posted February 2, 2009 Share Posted February 2, 2009 Quote: I've been thinking the same thing, even contacted the instructors with not much luck so far, but Cummins advised me to contact the head office in order to enroll in a course when they become available You probably won't have much luck with the instructors. Almost all of the Cummins training is Virtual College now. It requires you to be able access Cummins Quickserve. If your Distributor has in class training you will have to contact your DSM for your area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bruene Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 Originally Posted By: Keith Browning I was thinking... Since we may be dealing with Cummins as the only engine option on F-650/750 engines in the near future maybe we need to start collecting this kind of information and add it to the coffee table collection? I've been thinking the same thing, even contacted the instructors with not much luck so far, but Cummins advised me to contact the head office in order to enroll in a course when they become available. You'd be taking your training in Mississauga and/or Scarborough at Centennial College. There has been technicians all the way from Sarnia and even Michigan attending some of the courses I've been to. Virtual College is the prerequisite for all the courses... as well has having to take a WEEK long basic electical theory and troubleshooting course... booooring! But that course does teach you about using INSITE, which is pretty good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 Personally I think a lot of guys would benefit from a basic electrical course or a refresher for many of us... myself included. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Bruene Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 Personally I think a lot of guys would benefit from a basic electrical course or a refresher for many of us... myself included. I agree with you. I was surprised to learn how much I actually forgot about Ohms Law. But, a week was a bit much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Browning Posted February 22, 2009 Share Posted February 22, 2009 Okay, Ill concede that a WEEK is more than ample time to cover basic electrical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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